How to Grow a Podcast Audience Without Making It About Yourself with Dave Campbell

The Importance of Hitting Record

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Dave Intro 0:57

What if the secret to podcasting isn't better gear, bigger numbers, or going viral? What if it's simply pressing record? In this episode of Podcast About Podcasting, Gabe Lyell sits down with podcaster, creator, and community builder Dave Campbell to unpack what it really takes to build a podcast that lasts. From creating over 2,000 episodes across multiple shows to building deep audience connections one listener at a time, Dave shares why the future of podcasting belongs to creators willing to stop chasing perfection and start serving people. You'll hear powerful insights on why podcasting has no gatekeepers, how to focus on your audience instead of yourself, the mindset shift that keeps creators from quitting after five episodes, building sustainable systems and content workflows, and why even one listener can change everything. This isn't a conversation about becoming famous. It's about finding your voice, building meaningful connections, and creating something that matters. So grab your mic, silence the doubt, and hit record because your audience is waiting.

Gabe Leal 2:27

To jump into this world of podcasting based off of the idea of wanting to start a show. And then secondly, how to sustain something for the long term, because this that's the magic sauce that gets left out on a lot of shows when I hear them talking about the podcast and how to how to podcast and how to build something is the ability to make it sustainable. So, Dave Campbell, let's start with you. We're gonna go with the first question that I've asked every single guest that I bring onto the show. Why should you start a podcast? You have an idea, you have a concept, you have content that you think you're really passionate about, but why a podcast? Why not write a blog or create YouTube videos? Why why get behind

Why Start a Podcast?

Gabe Leal 3:09

a microphone and say I'm gonna record and do a podcast?

Dave Campbell 3:12

If you are a writer, a blog makes a lot of sense. I'm not a writer. So speaking for me is probably easier. Um I can turn it around a lot faster. I'm a musician, I've been doing music for a long time. So I'm used to being on the mic in bands and on stage. So I have that kind of going for me already. So for me, it just made logical sense that a podcast would be a good starting point for me. Um, and I just I love I love talking to and meeting people through podcasting as well. So it's opened a lot of doors.

Gabe Leal 3:42

Yeah. And I and I like that. You're kind of leading into the next part about it. Uh so you said that podcasting changed your life through connecting with other people. Walk me back to the moment you realized that uh having these conversations became real and not some you know idea or summary that having conversations really did change who you were and what you got out of connecting with people in general through the power of uh an hour long or 30-minute conversation.

Dave Campbell 4:08

Yeah, when when I guess when people started reaching out as listeners and connecting was when I'm like, oh, this is a real thing. Like I'm actually getting into the hearts and minds and ears of people around the world. It's just the the coolest experience ever to know that your voice can travel so far, right? So between between the guests on the show and then the listeners, I think that combination of the two. Once I started hearing back from people and connecting with people, I'm on a mission in my life to collect as many people in my my life as possible. That's kind of my goal. So I've added you to my collection game. So that's that's my goal. And I think podcasting has opened the door to do that very quickly.

Gabe Leal 4:51

Yes, and I and you know, one of the other things that I've kind of developed in doing this show was the understanding that for most podcasters, not all, but for most pat podcasters, is a realization that what they take from the actual conversation, other than just being a host, like the connection that that develops between you and a guest or you and an audience that shifts how you approach things because now you have you have a power that you didn't realize that you had prior to doing a podcast. Like you have a power to connect with people and shift and change people's ideas or influence. And there's a lot of responsibility that goes with that. And I want to I want to make that clear for a lot of podcasters starting out here. You you can have a powerful voice and you can influence people's lives, but hopefully that there's something good that comes out of what you're creating and what you're putting out into the world. So you said that there are no rules. I want to question you on that because uh this show exists specifically to answer whether someone should podcast at all. But if there are no rules in how you approach podcasting,

Breaking Down Barriers in Podcasting

Gabe Leal 5:56

what's the right answer then for if podcasting is right for everybody?

Dave Campbell 5:59

So if there's rules, that means if you break the rules, you're not allowed to be here. Right? A rule is a rule that keeps people like let's say, like there's the pool, you know, no diving at the pool. If you dive in the pool, you have to leave. That's a rule. In podcasting, if there's rules, then there's the chance that some people won't meet the expectations of the rules, and then there's no room for you. So if you go to an amusement park, you have a sign that says you must be this tall to ride this ride. That's a rule for your safety, it makes sense. But if we go around in podcasting and put up rules saying you have to do it this way, and if you do it that way or not my way, then it's you're not welcome here. I want to go around and tear down every sign that keeps people from starting a podcast that makes you feel like you're not welcome here because of where you came from, your education, your finances, your influence, your name. Right? I want to get rid of all that. If if we could if we could really make podcasting what it was meant to be, gatekeep free, like there's no gatekeeper, right? Then that's the rules that I want to pull down. So between between our shows, that's what I want to I want to encourage people that are listening and watching this, that listen, you there's a space for you here, and you don't have to have to follow some arbitrary rule that I made up to to be able to be a part of podcasting. Yeah.

Gabe Leal 7:26

Well, I love that because I this is to to the idea is that I want my my show will focus primarily on the new and the emerging podcaster who's getting started. The seasoned people, I mean, they've gone through it, right? I mean, what I want from them is the acquired knowledge that they have, like all the scrapes, the bumps and bruises, the scar tissue that comes from doing these things, so that it that it lessens hopefully the resistance for new podcasters getting started to again jump into this field because one of the most stocking shocking stats that I did when I'm researching whether or not to start this show was people were saying the the the podcast market is saturated, right? That there's so many podcasters and everything else. Yet projections will tell you if you go look at these statistics, it'll be a $50 billion industry by the year 2030. We're not that far off. We're four years from there, right? And it's gonna be a $50 billion industry. What does that tell you about whether or not the saturated the market is saturated or there's not enough here, right? Yeah, I think it is the people that hide behind the gates, they're the gatekeepers that want to keep certain aspects about it from other again, from people getting started and building a voice. Well, yeah, it's the point of this to is to lessen that resistance again to get started. So in creating a podcast, you sit down, you said, okay, no rules, but we're gonna we're gonna hit record. What would you say would be the next step that's a a brand new podcaster would learn, or what would you advise them to learn, other than just hitting record and saying, Okay, it's done. I've recorded my conversation or I've recorded

Identifying Your Audience

Gabe Leal 9:03

my solo podcast. What's the next step that they need to really focus on that'll help them build something that can be sustainable for again for the long run?

Dave Campbell 9:11

Starting points always kind of seem to go back to identifying your audience and who you're serving through your show. Because if you don't know who you're serving, it's really hard to create content or bring on the right guests or create the right topic because you don't really know who you're talking to. So if I was creating a restaurant, I want to know who my clientele is so I could serve them well and meet their expectations. So I'm gonna create the food at my restaurant that's gonna bring people through the door. I want to make sure my food is good. So I'm gonna ask for people to taste it to make sure it's good. I want to make sure everything is the way it should be. So when I open the doors to my community, I'm meeting the needs, right? So and same in podcasting. I want to create the content that's gonna serve my audience. I want to make sure it's good. So I'm gonna put it in front of people I trust and say, can you can you check this out and make sure that this is this is what I here's my expectations. And do you think I'm meeting this? So getting feedback. And I think all that comes through community. And you can't, I'm on a on a mission as well, Gabe, to to reinforce that nobody should podcast alone. I think you should have somebody in your world, right? Like I talked to my wife about podcasting, she kind of rolls her eyes, like, oh, this again, right? It's like you can you talk about anything else beside podcasting. But so I need somebody in my life that embraces that, who understands what it's like to create content and and go through all the seasons of podcast creation, right? So we need those people in our life. So that's kind of who I want to surround myself.

Gabe Leal 10:39

I like that. Now, this is the part that I like to really jump into for a lot of podcasters because we're gonna jump in a little bit into the technical side. We need to know that we're getting to the idea of the why. Now let's let's get into that side. So, you know, when you share the idea of building a back-end system, a workflow, what are some of the things that maybe you you've heard other new podcasters they go the wrong, they to prevent them from making the wrong sort of moves that they that alleviate the stress of having to go do double work and having to do things over and over again so that you know most of us podcasters, we do have busy lives. We do have some of us have full-time jobs. We do we start out with doing this as a as a hobby and decide to move into it with with more intention. So, how do you what do you do in your back end systems that you would share that maybe will help again, somebody new sitting down and deciding whether or not should I start a podcast in 2026?

Dave Campbell 11:34

So again, going back to feedback is helpful, getting some coaching, getting somebody on your side that can who's further down the road from you that could really help you. I try to have three people in my life, somebody ahead of me that I look up to that I can kind of grow towards. I will have somebody beside me who's kind of at the peer level, who's kind of where I'm at, and then somebody behind me who's just starting, who looks to me as maybe an inspiration. And those are the three people I like

Building a Sustainable Podcast

Dave Campbell 12:01

to focus on. And if I could have that combination of those three, someone ahead of me, someone with me, and someone who looks up to me, then then I have like a really well-rounded approach to what I'm doing. I think the other part of this is where I see a lot of podcasters struggle is they they run out of content ideas quickly. They start a show, and then five episodes in, they're like, now what do I talk about? Like the excitement and the hype of starting it is great, but then there's the longevity of it, you know, and then you're like, wow, now I gotta do this every week, twice a month, every month, every day. I'm doing a daily podcast right now, so 365 episodes in a row, right? So I'm like day 79, day 80 right now, as we're talking about recording. So every single day I have a podcast episode, and then I have eight other shows as well. I have nine different podcasts that I host. So I'm creating 12 to 15 episodes a week right now for all my different shows. So for me, the way I keep track of my content is I just I treat life like a piece of clothing where everything sticks to you, like that sweater. You're like, you're picking off this lint, like, where'd that come from? Where'd this hair come from? Right. I think you should let life stick to you. So as you just go around your day and as you do things, ideas are gonna come to you, thoughts are gonna come to you, you're gonna see something on TikTok, you're gonna hear it on a podcast. I just email myself all these things, these momentary pieces of my life. And I just have a folder and I just put everything there in my in my folders. And when I come to sit down to do my recordings, I just go to my folder, pull up my list of things that caught my attention, and that's where I start from. So just let life stick to you, and that's gonna help you to define your content. So, again, going back to the beginning, though, you gotta know who you're talking to so that you can find the content to serve them well. So start there.

Gabe Leal 13:47

Yeah, I like that. I like that a lot because there's a lot I I tell people in doing research, just like you said, go go to any podcasting directory on Apple, Spotify, you know, wherever you find your podcast. Type in a random podcast name, and you'll see how many of them kind of just branch off. You'll see that they have the four episodes or five episodes, and then there's nothing else, and you're like, um, you know, what was it, you know, what eventually led to them walking away? Was it the fact that the the work was a little too daunting, or was it that you know, the subject matter they ran out of it? You know, that there's a lot to go through play into that. And and I and I would hope um in what we're what I'm trying to create here will help people understand. Like the there's a lot of front end, there's a lot of back end work that goes into actually what what we're doing now, this is the fun part. This is the part that every everybody just enjoys, is the conversation, like getting here, but it's it's the buildup to everything else, right? Yeah. So how do you go about finding your guest when you invite them on when you do an interview show? Do you have a particular vetting process? Is it people within your community? Do you get secondhand recommendations from people

Finding and Vetting Guests

Gabe Leal 14:58

of saying you should speak with this person? How do you find the guest that you invite on?

Dave Campbell 15:01

So each of my shows are different. I have a dad podcast, I have an author podcast, I have a music podcast, I have a children's podcast, I have a podcast about podcasting, I have all these different things, right? So for my author podcast, the what that what's I find interesting about that show is I am I'm not an author, and I'm the host of the podcast. So when I meet an author, they're anticipating that I've written a book and I've never written a book. So I am completely a novice to anything to do with publishing, right? So by by being the non-author host, I I represent my audience. I represent the audience of authors who are just starting, listening to the show, and I offer I represent the readers who will never write a book. But we get to have conversations with these authors that they don't get anywhere else because they're usually going on shows that are hosted by a fellow author. And you get two authors together, they do author talk, and yeah, I have no idea what they're saying, right? I have no idea what you're saying. So I wanted to be the alternative to that. So for that show, imagine trying to get my first five guests on that show, right? I'm reaching out to authors saying, hi, my name is Dave. Would you like to come on my podcast, living the next chapter? And they're like, Who are you? And I'm like, Well, I'm a guy that reads books. They're like, You're not even an author? No thanks. I've got a lot of no thanks at the beginning. Wow. Right now I'm at 750 episodes for that show over three years. I have more people reaching out to my show than ever before, to the point where I've actually shut off my emails because I just I can't I can't keep up. There's that kind of that that happens, right? And all I do in that show, Gabe, is I just show up and serve my guests to the best of my ability and be curious and give them the best conversation they've had on a podcast. That's my goal. If I can leave them at the end of the conversation going, my gosh, that was the best time I've had on a show for a long time. Thank you. Like that's that's meaningful for me. And I get to serve them all. I make no money from that show. I don't have any ads, I have no sponsors, but I just serve my guest. And it's great.

Gabe Leal 17:02

I love that. So as somebody who does a podcast about podcasting, let me pick your brain. Yes. Then we go, we go down this line. So, what do you say is probably the biggest challenges that you have from audience members when it comes to asking the questions about uh I'm interested in in a in in getting started in podcasting? Is it from the content side? Is it the tech side, or is it like the distribution or the uh promotion side? Where do you figure most of your audience comes wanting to dig information from what you're talking about?

Dave Campbell 17:36

If they're starting, it's it's there's there's some tech questions, but it's podcasting getting more easier and easier as we go. More tools are coming out, making things faster and and simplifying a lot of the the tech side of what we do in podcasting, which is great. That means that again, no gatekeeping. Tech's not something that's gonna keep people out. So that's good, that's a good win. I like that. So the starting part, there's just some of the basics and just getting them set up, and then understanding kind of the process of how a podcast gets from your microphone to someone's ears, those kind

Overcoming Challenges in Podcasting

Dave Campbell 18:10

of questions, right? And then just the basic setup, getting them on all the app platforms. That's fine. That's part of it, and then the content creation and the calendar of just kind of coming up with something, some ideas, right? And being able to map out where you want to go on your show. Great, identifying your audience, all those things. Then you get into making money with your show and growing your show. That seems to be a common thing that most podcasters are gonna ask about. And when I hear somebody say, Hey Gabe, I want I want to grow my show. Um when people ask me that, I'm like, what do you mean by grow? And they're like, What do you mean? What do I mean by grow? I'm like, well, what about what if growing your show means growing the depth of your connection with your audience? Not numerically, but now I know the name of my listener. And I know that Keith listens to my show and he lives in Scotland, and he listens to my show when he walks the dog by the ocean. So when I record my episode, I'm thinking to Keith. I know that I have Eric who lives in Texas, down where you are. And Eric is a real estate agent and he's an amazing human being, and he's also a Santa at Christmas. He's got the big white beard, he's an amazing guy. But he listens to every episode of my show. Like every day. Every day he listens to my show. So once you get to that level of connection, that's growth. I've grown my audience by growing the depth of my connection with my audience. It's not getting bigger, but it's getting deeper, right? So that's growth. Right. So when somebody says, I want to grow my show, I'm always pushing back saying, Well, grow how. Yeah. So little things like that. So that's where we would go once you have your show set up.

Gabe Leal 19:42

Yeah. And when it comes to say doing um those types of conversations, do you get into the reality of letting them know that this is there? It's very, very rare that there's this, there's an overnight success, right? That there's somebody that that launches and they go into the stratosphere of like uh Joe Rogan or the you know, talk or call my daddy podcast or whatever the hell. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But that that's not that that that's the exception to the rule, but for most podcasters who want to get started, they they do have this idea, this grandiose idea in their head that I I can get to that level. And not that it that's a bad thing to have that as a goal, but to also give them the idea, it takes work to get there. Like, how good are you at marketing? How good are you at uh promotion? So I I want to get into that part of it too, because for a lot of podcasters, they do seem to struggle when it comes to promotion, especially self-promotion, because they're here's the thing that I've taken out of the so I've had already about 15, 16 conversations now with with podcasting hosts, and a lot of them, the thing that really touched on was that in the beginning I had a hard time promoting myself, like talking about myself. So, how do you how do you rationalize that for somebody who's getting

Promoting Your Podcast Effectively

Gabe Leal 21:01

started to say you're gonna have to learn how to you know bolster your own numbers or not bolster your own numbers, but bolster your own self so that people will want to listen in so you can get the opportunity to build and grow a deeper audience, a deeper connection.

Dave Campbell 21:17

When people come to me and they're a little bit shy about promoting themselves, I I try to turn it back to them and say, is this show about you or is it about your audience? If your show is about your audience, don't you want them to know about it? Like that would make sense, right? You have a good, valuable show and there's great content, great guests. You're you're putting your heart and soul into this. It's not something you're doing just because you're bored. You really want to create a great, great show. So there's a lot of value in what you do. Don't you think that people would love to hear about something valuable? Yeah. So then you need to talk about it. You need to get out there and share. Because the more people that hear about your valuable show and the valuable content you create, the more people you can help. So it's not really about you. As the host, it's more about your content and it's more about your audience. So the more you talk about the bigger your audience is going to grow, or the depth again, of your audience will grow over time. So don't worry so much about it being all about you. Focus more on what the show can do for somebody else.

Gabe Leal 22:16

Yeah, I like that. Because I think that's one thing that gets lost in translation when you're talking about promotion. They think it's about me that I and if you feel bad about promoting yourself, that can be a hindrance to somebody who wanted to get a message out, right? And I think what you just shared there about focusing on your audience, like focusing on that community. Yeah, I think that would alleviate a lot of people finding a lot of the hard parts about talking about myself as uh you know, as a host, not that it's a bad thing. I think self-promotion is just part of what we do because you're gonna have to learn how to promote and find these avenues. So, what are some of the best channels that you would say people can go to promote and find an audience, right? They might have a message, they're starting out brand new. Uh, I don't have no community, I don't have members yet. What are there some of the channels that they could possibly benefit from as far as putting out their podcast so they can start discovering who's gonna listen, what their audience is? Even though your content is specific and it might be niche and you might be talking about comics or film or anime, you still have to find an audience for it to resonate with. So, what are some of the channels that they could possibly go and search to maybe find that audience?

Dave Campbell 23:27

I love being in the room with people who talk about what I want to talk about. So I have a dad podcast. So for me to go to any kind of men's event, any kind of men's focused event, any dad-focused event, great. I need to be there. And it's great to go to podcasting conferences because you get to meet podcasters actually and to meet people like you, right? So that would be great. But at the same time, I'm not really meeting the direct listener of my show. I'm meeting, I'm meeting my peers, which is great. I think that's awesome to do that. But anytime you can meet somebody who's not your peer in podcasting, but your potential audience, then I think that's a great opportunity because you're in front of people who would be your ideal listener. So that's one. And the other part would

The Importance of Self-Promotion

Dave Campbell 24:13

be to be a guest on shows and doing it right now, right? Be on someone else's podcast because we are talking to podcast listeners. We're talking to people who listen to shows. When I go on Instagram, not everybody on Instagram is a podcast listener, but everyone that's here right now with us is a podcast listener. So this is where you fish where the fish are, and this is where they are. So be on a guest on podcasts, get your message out there, and go and serve as a guest on your favorite podcast. Collaborate with other podcasters. We are probably the nicest people in content creation, us podcasters. We love helping each other, right? So go and and give value, serve, be a guest, have other people on your show, collaborate. I love doing like shout-outs with other people who I would actually say would be my competition in podcasting. Yeah. Really. But bringing their content into my show, shouting them out, giving them praise, supporting them, being out there in the community, pushing and lifting everyone else up around me. That's how we we find our audience and it's how we grow.

Gabe Leal 25:19

Yeah, I love that because it again, in correlation to what we're doing here, I mean, we're doing something very similar, but the goal, but again, it it's it's how you focus it, right? Me, for me, it's the focus will be on the new and inspiring podcasters because I I want to help people craft a voice, right? So that's my focus is on on the new people, on the people who haven't started yet or want to sit down. There's something about their eagerness to want to learn to get into that that I love having those conversations and being able to harness that type of energy to being excited to say, I am now a podcaster, I can do this, like this is incredible. That's the payoff for me. So that's why the reason I I I'm doing this show in segments. I'm starting out with with podcasters who develop like you you got 2,000 episodes. What can I teach you? I mean, I don't what can I teach you as far as like the bumps and bruises of going through a podcast? Right. But I'm also the next series will be you know the emerging podcaster. I'm gonna have podcasters on who are you know no longer than 15 to 20 episodes because the beginning part's gonna be fresh to them. Like asking you to go back and do you remember episode number one? What was that like? Like the balls, and you're gonna be like, man, that's been I don't know, that's been years. Like you that you have to really activate the brain to go, right? What was that like? Yeah. So I want to do it in stages to where, again, I'm and and the next state after that is I'm gonna go find 12 to 15 aspiring podcasters who've never created a podcast but want to. Beautiful. And bring them on. Yeah. And give them the experience of being a guest, like you said. This is a perfect you're yes, this is why I love pros and experts who've spent the time into doing this, giving you the direct avenues of how to find and develop what it is that you're trying to do in an audience. So man, that was that's gold. So again, let's hit on that number because now I want to go into the the ability to sustain 2,000 episodes, right? Uh, for most podcasters, beginning from episode number one, they're like, nope, I can't imagine, I can't fathom what it's like, but here you are. So, what does it actually take to require that sort of discipline to sustain and create as many shows as you're creating as creating many episodes that that you're putting out there in the world that can one of our new podcasters can take advice from and say, hey, maybe I can apply this to my journey. Maybe I can resonate, I can take what Dave's message did and resonate with me to again to put into my system of how I want to go out and share my message out into the world.

Dave Campbell 27:51

Yeah. Well, first, don't compare episode five to my episode 2000. That's not fair to anybody. Um, so please don't do that. Compare your episode one to my episode one if you want to compare something. Right. That's a that's a more of a fair comparison, but even then, there's so much new knowledge in podcasting all the time that you've got a you've got a head start compared to where I started. So keep that in mind. The best comparison is a comparison for yourself against yourself and getting better every episode. That's it's like golf. It's a game of one. You can play it in a group, but it's a game of one. You're playing against yourself. So improve on your game, practice, do your work behind the scenes. And then when it comes to go set walking up to the tee and teeing off for the first time, you've got all the background. You know, you've hit the balls out into the field for days. You you practice your mini putt. I'm super good at mini putting. Um, that's about as far as I can go. But you've you've done the work behind the scenes. So then golf makes sense for you. So do the work behind the scenes and podcasting, and it'll become easier for you over time. Half of my interview, half of my podcast episodes are interviews. So when you do that many interviews, you start to get a feel on how to do an interview and how to ask great questions. The big one of the biggest lessons I learned early in my podcasting days, Gabe, was especially with a guest, was, and you're doing a great job of this, by the way, is listening and giving your guests room to talk. Because I was so anxious and I wanted to keep the conversation going that I would ask a question of my guests, and then before they finished, I would redirect them with the next question because my mind was spinning and I was I wanted to keep the conversation going and I just wanted I was excited. But my guests never got to finish their thought. They they would be thinking out loud and they'd be coming to the conclusion, and I'd ask another question and divert them away. And my audience reached out and they said, Dave, could you just let Gabe finish his thought? As a listener, I want to hear what Gabe has to say, right? Without you stepping on him. And I'm like, Oh, and you know what's the benefit of learning that lesson? My wife actually loves that as well, because I don't talk over her when she's talking. She's like, This podcast thing is actually not that bad, even though I roll my eyes when you ever you bring it up. I let my wife talk and I don't talk over her, and it's a good thing. So you'll be a better listener as well. There's so many benefits to podcasting beyond making money and getting a big audience. You as a human being will be different in the process of creating a podcast. So do it for that. Yeah.

Gabe Leal 30:21

And, you know, like you said, there there's there's there's something that there's an underlying tone that I've heard over all these conversations is that most of these podcast hosts that I'm I'm having these conversations with, that's one of part of the messages is like you become so much better at listening to people. Like, do you realize like how much how hard that is, how much of an acquired skill that is? Because, like you said, in the beginning, the process was I want to jump back in with my question. And

Sustaining a Podcast: Discipline and Growth

Gabe Leal 30:49

one of the one of the one of the hosts said it very perfectly well. If you want to just talk about you, do a solo show. Right. Nobody's saying that's wrong. Yeah. Like you, if you if that's the thing that you want to do and you want to focus on and all the thoughts that pop in your head, go ahead and do a solo show. But if you're gonna have an interview and you're gonna have guests on, let your guest be the center point, the center point of the conversation, not me. That's why I try to listen because I'm also taking notes and trying to learn something myself from this conversation. I try to take that with with every single like interview that I get to do, whether I am a guest or the host itself. I'm trying to take something from what we're discussing because it only helps me develop again, like you said, as a better person. My my wife is super appreciative, and I do a live stream with her. We do a show together. So it is it is learning how to you know branch off each other and communicate with each other. It only it only strengthens things. So I like that you that you did bring that up. So now I want to touch on one more thing before we start wrapping up. So, what would you say to somebody who say has started their podcast, published it, went out, started to try to and uh went out and promoted it, and yet they're not finding traction? They're not finding an audience, you know, getting five downloads a week, five down, you know, 20, maybe maybe 15 downloads a month. Like what would you say to somebody who's getting frustrated with saying, I'm putting in all this work, I'm doing this, I'm sharing it out into the world, and I'm not finding I'm not finding the right audience yet. I'm not finding anybody who's you know, building that again, that community, that audience that you want. How would you redirect them to maybe maybe refocusing or shifting their approach?

Dave Campbell 32:32

I actually did this with a podcaster recently, and I said to them, what's the minimum number of people you'd podcast for? Minimum, not the maximum, but the minimum that you would show up for. You would create the content, record the content, publish the content, do all the all the behind the scenes. How what's the minimum? And they just looked at me like no one's ever asked me that question before. And I said, Well, for me, if I was answering my own question, I would say one. If I could reach one person, and it sounds like Dave, that's pretty low barry bar. Like, come on, one? You would podcast for one person? Yeah, I would. And the reason why, and I actually did a little mini-series on my show around an apple seed. And I don't know if you've ever heard this before, Gabe, but uh is a quote that I heard a long time ago, and it said, You can count the number of seeds in an apple, but you can't count the number of apples in a seed. So you can cut an apple open, you can pick out all the apples, you can put them on the table, and there's 23 seeds. Pick up any one of those seeds and tell me, okay, how many apples are going to be the result of that one seed? You can't do it. There's no way to measure that, right? Now imagine if somebody listens to your podcast and because of your show, they go home and treat their partner better. They're a better parent for their kids, and their kids grow up in a new environment because of your show. Imagine if that person who is on a really destructive path in their life turned a corner because of your words, your guest, your content. And now where their life was ended to disaster, now they have a totally new path in life. On my Dad Space podcast in November, it's Movember, where it's about men's mental health and physical health. And I was talking on that, and there's a daily episode for Dad Space that I do in November. So 30 episodes in a row. I was talking about the fact that you need to, as a as guys, you need to own your mental health and you need to go get help from professionals. Don't try to do this yourself. And a listener in New Zealand reached out to me and said, Dave, I I've been listening to your show, and because of your podcast, I finally committed to going and getting the help I've always needed, but I just needed to hear it. And because of your show, I'm doing this. And now him and his children and his wife are benefiting from him getting the help he needs. I would podcast for one person, Gabe, if that was the result. One person. And I would be satisfied to not make one penny from my podcast, not have two listeners or five or a hundred thousand. If I could reach one person, and I genuinely mean this, I would still do all the work I do just to do that one thing. You can count the number of seeds in an apple, but you can't count the number of apples in a seed. I love that.

Gabe Leal 35:12

Man, that's what I speak to in my heart is impact. You can't measure it's it's it's it's an unmeasurable, measurable that people try to uh you know look at. And you can't. That's too hard. But it does, it does matter. So I love that you shared that. So again, listeners, take take notes. That's the that's the whole point of what we're doing here. So this is the fun part of the conversation where I get to ask. So, what's on the horizon for Mr. Dave Campbell as far as the nine shows that you're creating? Like, what else do you see? Do you ever see or envision yourself, since you're hosting one, writing a book on this or going down that avenue? Because you have so much content. I'm pretty sure you're content rich when it comes to what you could share your expertise on.

Dave Campbell 35:54

You know that thing where people have like a tall, like a stick, and then they put a plate on top of the stick and then they spin the plate, and then this plate spinning, and they have multiple sticks and multiple plates. I have nine of those going at the same time. So we're wobbling right now, just by the way. I gotta pay attention to those. But I I'm doing all these things at the same time. And I I I don't know what's next for me. I just know that I'm in podcasting now and I can't get out. So I love it.

Finding Your Audience and Impact

Dave Campbell 36:18

Um, for the how to podcast series, I'm doing the daily episodes, I said, so that's 365 episodes this year. In February, I did 24 episodes in 24 hours, a little marathon I gave myself where I recorded an episode every hour and published it every hour for 24 hours straight. So by 3 a.m., Gabe, I was like a puddle. I was just right. So, but I did it every episode, every hour. Um, so that was fun. That's really exciting for me. I'm also doing daily content on a social platform at the same time. So every day I'm showing up and talking to my audience, and then I have all my other shows, right? So I just keep pouring into each of the shows, and again, for that reason of just connecting with that one person, right? So I don't see an end to it. I would love to get to 10. That'd be an even number of podcasts. My wife is like, no, if I was to start another podcast, Gabe, it would be a local podcast for my local community because there's a lack of local content in our communities these days, right? Everyone's leaving. So TV's gone, newspaper's gone, radio's leaving. I'd much rather do a live podcast or a like a live podcast focused on my community. So that's kind of where I would love to go next, but again, the wife said no. So but yeah, so that's that's where I would love to go. Writing a book would be great. There's a lot of opportunities out there. Meeting people like you is great. And again, collecting people, that's my main focus.

Gabe Leal 37:42

I love that. Because one of the things that I'm trying to do here too is I'm I'm going that route of trying to find a um, you're in our local town, a local library where I can start a podcasting class. Nice. Because we do have a we do have a library here locally that they just opened a couple months ago that has its own podcasting studio. So why not start a class to get people to come in here and instead of just doing what I'm doing virtually, also do locally in person to help build another community around doing this and getting started. So I love that though. I would I would love that for you if you could. I mean, maybe that maybe the wife's like drop two of those shows and you go, you get going. But right. Thank you again, Dave. I do appreciate you taking the time to have this conversation. It's been great. And I'm taking so much from what you shared, and I want to be able to put it out into the world for people who want to get started into doing this because again, there is something about being able to craft your craft your voice that will make an impact in in on that one person, right? That that's that's to me, that's what matters. You the the you know, we've said every word that can be said, every note that it can be played has been played, but it's sometimes it's where it comes from. And the person that, you know, that message is you're the conduit to that message for somebody that's gonna actually resonate to them. They could have heard it from two other people, three other people. It could have been a family member, it could have been somebody else, but yet it was your voice, it was your message that seeped through and allowed them to hopefully change their life for the better. So I love that. Uh thank you again, Dave. Um again, I'm grateful. Thanks, Kevin.

Dave Campbell 39:20

And if you want to throw it in the notes, I have uh my my sign off for everyone, giftfromdave.com is my free gift to anybody who listens to your episode. And all that is really is a link in my calendar for time. So anytime they can use that giftfromdave.com. There you go. My website. There you go. All right.

Gabe Leal 39:39

It's there, it's gonna be playing the episode. So thank you, Dave. I do appreciate it. I gotta go let my dog out. There you go. Gotta go run, but thank you for the time. And like I said, I will be reaching out to you and I would love to join that community as well.

Dave Campbell 39:53

Excellent. Thanks, Gabe. Great show. Love your show, man. Good job. Keep going.

Gabe Leal 39:57

Bye-bye. Bye.

AI Outro 39:58

And that wraps up another episode of

Future Aspirations in Podcasting

AI Outro 40:00

Podcast About Podcasting with Gabe Leal. A huge thank you to Dave Campbell for sharing his wisdom, experience, and heart, for helping creators build podcasts that truly connect with people. If today's conversation resonated with you, make sure you go follow Dave Campbell and check out everything he's building over at howtopodcast.ca. You'll find his podcasts, creator resources, community meetups, coaching, and a ton of practical advice to help you grow as a podcaster without losing your voice in the process. And if you enjoyed this episode, don't forget to follow and subscribe to Podcast About Podcasting wherever you listen to podcasts. Most importantly, if these conversations, insights, and stories are helping you, share this episode with another podcaster, creator, or aspiring beginner who's thinking about starting their show. Sometimes one conversation is all it takes to help someone finally press record. Until next time, keep creating, keep learning, and keep podcasting.

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