How to Design Your Podcast Episode Blueprint for Success

Choosing the Right Podcast Format

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Intro Speaker 0:46

You've done the work. You figured out your niche. You know who you're talking to and why it matters. You've thought about it more than you probably want to admit. But here's the question nobody asked you yet. What actually happens when someone presses play on your show? Not the topic, the structure, the thing that happens in the first 60 seconds that tells a listener to stay or skip. The thing that determines whether you're still recording six months from now, or whether you've quietly joined the majority of podcasters who stopped somewhere around episode six and never came back. Today we fix that. Today we build your show Blueprint. This is the podcast about podcasting, the show for the person who keeps almost starting, and the podcaster who's in it and wondering if the work is actually going somewhere. Every week, real answers from real practitioners on the only question that matters before you recorded a single word. Why should you do a podcast? This episode is a solo one, no guest, just you and me and a framework that's going to change how you think about your show before you've recorded a single episode of it. Let's get into it.

Gabe 1:56

Here a is a mistake I see almost starters make constantly. They spend weeks, sometimes months, deciding on a topic. A name, cover art, a microphone, and it never stops to ask the one question that controls everything else. What kind of show is this? Not what is it about? What kind of show is it? Because that decision, the format, is what creates the container your content lives in. And if you don't choose it deliberately, it chooses itself, usually badly. There are five core podcast formats, but everything else is a variation of one of these. Let me walk you through each one so that you can recognize what you're actually drawn to, and more importantly, what can you actually sustain? So, format number one, the solo teaching podcast. This is a format built on a single premise. You have something to teach, and the microphone is your classroom. No guest, no co-host, just you and a thing you know better than most people in the room. Think of every podcast you've heard where someone breaks down a complex subject like finance, productivity, health, episode after episode. That's his format. It's also one of the most underrated confidence builders in podcasting because it forces you to actually organize your thinking before you speak it. And here's the honest trade-off it requires discipline. You can't lean on a guest to carry the conversation. Every episode rises or falls on your preparation. But if you have real expertise and if you're willing to build the habit of organizing it, this format builds authority faster than almost anything else. I mean, this is what we're doing here while you're listening to this. We're using the solo teaching podcast right now. And you're also going to see, and I'm going to talk about other formats that I use in this project and in other projects that fall along these lines of the five core the five core podcast formats. So let's talk about format number two. And that's the interview podcast. You already know this format because you've consumed it your entire life. One host, one guest, a conversation. It's the most common format in podcasting for a reason. It's compelling, scalable. And every guest brings in a built-in audience you can borrow if you play it right. Here's what most people get wrong about the interview format. They think the guest does the work. The guest doesn't do the work. You do the work before the recording, in the prep, and knowing the right questions to ask in the right moment. The guest brings the perspective, you bring the shape. And the honest trade-off in this one is that you become a calendar management expert because it becomes a real part of your workflow. You're booking people, doing follow-ups, sending intake forms, preparing question sheets, managing no shows. It's more logistical than the solo format, but if you want to build relationships and you love conversations and I do, there is no better vehicle. I've done over 500 interviews in my career as a host. And I'll tell you, this one here brings probably the fastest way to build a connection and a relationship. So that's format number two. And I'm using this format again in this project that we're doing here now. I'm bringing on other podcasters who are, again, have subject matter or subject matter experts in the world of podcasting. So I'm bringing them here on the show along with doing the solo teaching podcast. So we're doing a combination. We're going to talk a little bit more about what this is, though. So let's talk on the next podcast format, and that's the co-host conversation podcast. Two hosts, a shared topic, genuine chemistry between them, or the slow grinding absence of it, which is its own kind of podcast. Now I co-host Unwrap Love with my wife Yvette. I understand this format from the inside. And here's what I know to be true. The co-host format is not easier than solo. It's different. The chemistry has to be real, the dynamic has to be complementary, and someone has to be willing to play a different role when the conversation needs it. You both can't be the talker, and you both can't be the interrupter. And I'm here to tell you, when it works, it's the most listenable format in podcasting. When it doesn't, it sounds like two people who agree to record but forgot the reason why they're recording. They forgot to agree on that. And here's the honest trade-off. You are now scheduling two people's lives instead of one. If the chemistry dri if the chemistry dies, the show dies with it. But if you have the right person and the right dynamic, this format can feel effortless in a way nothing else does. So I've already covered three of these

Understanding Episode Length and Structure

Gabe 6:59

uh podcast formats that I use. Okay? And I and I use them quite frequently. So we're gonna go into the fourth podcast format, and that's the narrative storytelling podcast. Now, this is a high production format. Think scripted documentary, highly edited, usually serialized, the kind of show where everything is a chapter and something bigger. And I'm gonna be honest with you, this format is exceptional when it's done right. It is also the most difficult, the most time-intensive, and most resource-heavy format you can choose. The best narrative podcasts have production teams, they have editors, they have a budget for music licensing and sound design. If you're a beginner building your first show, this is not where you start. I don't say that to diminish the format. I say it because I've watched people attempt at spending three months producing a single episode, burn out completely, and walk away from podcasting entirely. The barrier is real. You gotta respect it. But if you have a story that can be told any other way and you're willing to do the work, this format can be extraordinary. So it takes a lot, and I've had a few podcast hosts that come on who walk this line of creating the narrative storytelling podcast. And yes, it is a little bit more labor-intensive. And they'll share their stories. Uh, if you continue to listen in, you'll you'll hear the you know, that you'll hear their insights on why they chose to do a narrative storytelling podcast. So we'll dive a little bit deeper into those later on in the season. Let's talk about format number five, the hybrid format. And this is the format this is the format most flexible podcasters end up choosing. And it's the one I'd point most beginners toward because it gives you room to figure out who you are as a host without locking into a single mode. Hybrid shows mix solo segments and interview conversations. Some episodes you bring in a guest, some episodes you record alone, just like this. Some episodes you do both. Like this show does with the interview guest followed by a solo debriefing. Because we want to share the technical aspect, so we want to dive deeper into the solo teaching part. But we don't want to lose the aspect of so many amazing podcasters who have insights to share as well. So that's why we do both. And the honest trade-off on this one is it requires you to be uh competent in two modes instead of one. But it also means that if you if you can't book a guest one week, you still have a show. And if you want to go deep solo on a topic your guest has touched on, you can. It's the most resilient format for a beginner begin for a beginner building a sustainable practice. So think about those five. Because when you sit down, and last week we covered content pillars and how to develop and design those. The next thing is what you need to do to create the format that goes with those content pillars. So understanding how you want to format is again just as important as knowing what you're gonna talk about. So let's go on and talk about another question that I that I've been asked, and I ask all my podcasters when they come on here. But the next one is choosing your episode length. And this one is gonna feel like a small decision until you realize how much it shapes everything else. How long should your episodes be? Here is the wrong answer. As long as they need to be. That sounds wise. It isn't. It's why people say when you haven't thought it through yet, if you don't decide on a link before you start recording, you end up with an episode that sprawls, or worse, an episode that gets cut short because you ran out of material. Neither one of those is something that you want. So here's some actual framework. Three tiers. Think about which one matches your content and your your listeners' context. Okay. So here's the first one, and I and I hear a few of those all the time. And these are great. The 10 to 15 minute, the quick hit podcast. One insight delivered sharp and clean, great for commuters, people who listen while they walk, and topics where the depth is less important than efficiency. The constraint forces discipline. You can't afford to wander. This linked also trains you as a host to get to the point. So if you're gonna do the quick hit podcast, you know, you you you learn how to have to train yourself to how to get from point A to point Z pretty quickly. And there's nothing wrong with this. There's great podcasts out there that are short, that are that don't have you don't have to have an elongated podcast. Again, this is picking what works for you. Okay? So here we go for the next, this is the next tier. This is the 20 to 30 minutes, this is the standard. The most common linked in podcasting for a reason. If it's a commute, a gym session, a lunch break, long enough to develop a real idea, short enough to stay focused. If you're not sure where to start, this is where I would suggest you start. Give yourself somewhere about 20 to 30 minutes to talk about your subject. If you think you need a little bit more time to go in depth into your topic and your pillars, and you're looking at your content pillars, and you say, I can't cover that 10 to 15 minutes. Okay, here you go. Give yourself 30 minutes. So that's tier number two. Tier number three, we're talking about 45 to 75 minutes. And this is the deep dive conversation podcast. This is where interview shows and co-hosts usually live. Long enough for real relationships to develop between host and guest requires editing discipline. You can't just let the conversation, you can't just let the conversation run and call it an episode. Cut the tangents, protect the listener's time. Now, I've had people come on and they say they talk about it, they talk and they've had two-hour conversations on a podcast. Not saying that there's nothing wrong with it, but the commitment and the time that you're asking somebody to commit to listen, that takes a lot. So if you're gonna head down this path of a deeper conversation, and most of these have been about the the interview podcasts have been about uh an hour long, 45 minutes to an hour. And then these I try to keep within the 20 to 30 minute range in the teachings. So that's what's one thing you can choose about choosing your episode length. And here's the thing, nobody says clearly enough. Your listeners are making decisions about your show in the first 30 seconds when they see the episode in their feed. And your length is one of those things that they're evaluating. Evaluating, excuse me, if you're a 45 minute, if you're at 45 minutes this week and 25 the next two weeks, you're not just inconsistent, you're telling your listeners that you haven't figured out what kind of show this is yet. Even if your content is great, that inconsistency costs you trust. Pick a range,

Building a Repeatable Episode Flow

Gabe 14:02

not a number, a range. 30 to 45 minutes, 50 to 70, whatever your format fits, and then hold it. Give yourself the constraint. The constraint is what creates the discipline, and the discipline is what creates the show. So in these episodes, I know that I want to keep my my solo teachings around 30 minutes, and then I want I know that I want to keep my interviews about an hour long because I give my guests that much to share their insights. Because most of the podcasters I've had on have been doing this for you know three to three to ten years, and they have, you know, three to twelve, two thousand episodes, somewhere somewhere in there. Pretty crazy. So they have a lot of insights and experiences that they can share. So that's the that's the next thing we talked about. Now we're gonna talk about building a repeatable episode flow. So building your flow, this is important too. I want to tell you something that took me longer to understand than it should have. The reason most podcasters quit isn't equipment, it isn't niche, it isn't even audience size, it's the blank recording session. You sit down, you press record, you stare at your microphone, wondering what actually happens next. What do you say first? How long do you spend on an intro? You know, when do you get to your main content? How do you close? Do you wing it? The episode comes out shapeless. You listen back to it, and it doesn't sound like a show. It sounds like someone talking into a microphone. And so you do it again next week until it sounds and it still sounds shapeless, excuse me. And eventually you stop. A repeatable episode flow solves this. It is the most single underrated tool for sustainability in podcasting, not a script, not a structure, a container, you know, you pour your content into so that every episode, no matter the topic, no matter the guest, has the same skeleton underneath it. Let me give you the framework, five elements. Every gate, every great podcast episode has all five of them in some version. So, number one, the intro, the promise. What will your listener what will your listener know or be able to by the end of your episode? Not a summary, a promise. Delivered in the first six to nine, there's sixty to ninety seconds. This is your handshake with the listener. This is where they decide to stay. Then there's the main content. That's number two, the delivery. Teaching, conversation, narrative, whatever form that takes. This is the bulk of the episode. Within a section, you can have sub segments, transitions, guest questions, whatever you need. This container is flexible, but it has to be anchored by the promise you made in the intro. Then we're gonna go to number three, key takeaways, a summary. Two or three things specific, concrete, actionable, not feelings, not inspiration, the things that you want your listeners to write down, even if they weren't taking notes, this segment tells them what you should have, you know, what they should have been writing. So that's the next thing. You you're gonna go from you're gonna go from the intro, your promise, main content, the delivery, key takeaways, the summary, and then we're gonna go to number four, the call to action, your CTA, the next step. One thing, not three, not five, one. Subscribe, review, go to the website, send me a voice note, follow me on Instagram. Pick one per episode and rotate. More than one CTA at once is no CTA at all. It's noise. So remember, pick one, pick a good one. If it's this one, if it's at this end of this episode, it's hey, go, you know, go to our Apple Podcast and leave us a review. Or go check out our YouTube page. Whatever that is, give them a call to action. And then lastly, the outro, the close. Brief, warm, specific. Reference something from this episode, not genetic filler. Thanks for being here. Talk to you soon, it's fine. But thanks for sitting with this. Excuse me, but thanks for sitting with that question about consistency with me is better. It tells your listener that they were actually listening, they were actually here listening for something. So again, the real real brief, we're gonna go to our intro, our main content, your key takeaways, your call to action, and your outro. Now, here's what I want you to understand about this structure. It's not a cage, it's just kind of a roadmap. When you know your roadmap, when you have it memorized, when you can fill it in the rhythm of your of an episode, you can break it. You can skip the formal takeaway sections because the whole conversation has the takeaway. You can extend the main content because the conversation earned it. You can move the CTA at the top because this particular episode needs it there. But you can take a break from the rules intentionally if you know what the rules are. The host who wings it, every episode doesn't break rules. They just never make them. And there's a difference. And I'll say one more thing about flow, then we're moving on. The intro matters most more

Naming Segments and Creating Identity

Gabe 18:50

than you think it does. Not because it's mostly important content, it's the most important content, it's the episode, it usually isn't, but it's because it's the audition. You your listeners decide to press play, they haven't decided to stay yet. You have somewhere between 60 seconds, three minutes to make your case that this is the episode is worth it, that this episode is worth listening and it's worth their time. What you have to say in that window and how you say it determines everything that follows. Don't waste it on housekeeping, don't spend on reading your own bios. Don't use it to remind people what the show is about. If they listen, they already know. Use it to name the one thing this episode is going to give them, then go give it to them. Okay, let's move on to the next part, naming your segments. Here is the part of the conversation that sounds like branding advice, but it's actually something deeper. Within your flow episode, you have the option to name your segments, and I'm gonna argue that you should. Not because names make a show sound professional, but because names create identity. They signal to your listener that this is a recurring element, something they can expect, something they can look forward to and finding in every episode. Named segments are how you build rituals inside a show, and your rituals are how your listeners should become regulars. Think about the show, think about the shows you you actually listen to that you're loyal to. Not the ones that you binge and forget, the ones you schedule your week around. Bet there's something in every episode that feels like coming home. Excuse me, a recurring segment, a signature question, a phrase that always that the host always uses, that's not an accident, that's architecture. Here's some things to make this concrete. I'm not telling you to use these, I'm telling, I'm using them to show you the logic behind them. Okay? So maybe you do something like creator insight, a two-minute solo moment where you distill one specific observation from your week. Doesn't have to be long, it doesn't have to be sharp. This segment trains your listener to expect your voice, your perspective, your editorial eye. It's the segment that makes you irreplaceable because no guest can deliver a creator insight, only you can. Okay. Um, we do a segment on our um co-hosted show, my wife. We call it red flag, green flag. And we built this into the segment. We do a weekly poll segment. So we we break it down

Final Thoughts and Homework Assignment

Gabe 21:16

into uh segments so that people become familiar with again, with the flow of our show. And I'm giving you a few of these that you can you can name. How about the podcast tip of the week? One actionable tip. You know, 30 to 60 seconds, simple, transferable, works in any format. The constraint of one tip forces you to choose the most valuable thing, which is self-a discipline worth developing. And because it's named, listeners who missed the main content will still stay for the tip. Or something like the mic drop moment, or a listener question. You know, these are important too. You know, you get your listener involved, they they send in a uh uh an audio clip and you take it in, or they email the show. Read a question from someone in your audience. Answer it. Name the person who sent it. This segment does three teams, three things simultaneously. It gives you your most engaged listeners a voice. It tells every other listener that real people are engaging with the show and it gives you built-in content without having to generate everything from scratch. When you're in the throw of early episodes with nobody listening, this segment is what you build towards because the day someone sends in the first question is a real moment. Now you don't need four name segments. You might need one. You might need none right now. And two by episode 15. The point is to not perform isn't the point is to not perform structure, is to create the recurring touch points that make your show feel like a show instead of a collection that happened to share that happens to be shared in R in an RSS feed. Okay. So that's that's another one. And again, these are these are tips that I'm trying to get you to understand when you're building a show. Again, building your format is important because it's gonna help your workflow. Trust me, there's nothing easier than having a workflow that you've already put together and then building in your templates or what you know, building in your format for your show. And then the last segment we're gonna talk about is the homework. Here's where we land. Every episode of this show ends the same way with one thing not a feeling, not a mind shift, something that you can actually do before the next episode drops. You know, this week we're building your show blueprint, not recording it, not publishing it, writing it down one page. That's your assignment. So ask your people, ask your listeners, hey, this is your homework. So anyone listening to this episode, that is your homework. If you're a new or aspiring podcaster and you haven't figured out this stuff yet, this is where you need to write this down. Write down your show blueprint. And think about that before the next episode drops. Write down these four things, one page, pen and paper, or you can voice record it. There's some, you know, as long as you have something in writing that makes it real. So remember, you if we're gonna figure out these these four things, your format. Are you gonna do a solo, interview, co-host, narrative, or hybrid? Name it. Put it down. You know, name the one that that scares you the least and commit to it for the first 10 episodes. You can also revise it. That's the beautiful thing about all these things. And then your target episode length. Again, not the specific number, arrange 15 to 30 minutes, 30 to 45, 45 to 75, whatever fits your format and your listeners' likely context. Then your episode flow. Write out the five beats your intro, your main content, the takeaways, your CTA, your call to action, and your outro. Under each one, write one sentence that will specifically happen on your show. Okay? Not a template your show. And then do your one record your one recurring segment. Name it. Just one. What's the thing you want listeners to look forward to every episode? Name it. If nothing comes to mind right now, write down TBD. Leave a space for it. Leave the space for that until you find your way to work it into. Like for this one, I I want anyone listening. If you have any questions about the show, feel free to email me. Um it is podcast about podcasting at gmail.com. And just title it, hey Gabe, here's my homework or here's my question. If you do that one thing, one page, four sections, you will have something that most podcasters who have been doing who've been at who've been at this two years still don't have yet a clear, deliberate blueprint for their show. Not a vague idea, not inspiration, a document. Keep it somewhere visible. Because every time you sit down and record, the question is not what do I talk about today? The question is what goes in this container. And if you know your container, you can fill it with anything. So think about those. Sit down for a minute, write out your homework, write out your blueprint. Think about those four things: your format, your target episode linked, your episode flow, and then your recurring segment. Okay. That whole that's the you know, that's the the whole thing is that's your should should be your philosophy in one sentence. Know what your container is, what you keep in there. So I do appreciate everyone who's been tuning in and listening to this one. Um, thank you for sitting with this one. I know format conversations can feel like the unsexy part of podcasting. Everybody wants to talk about guest growth and going viral, but this is foundational. And nothing you build on an unclear foundation survives long enough to matter. Do the blueprint. One page, then press record. It'll be amazing what you'll be able to accomplish once you have a roadmap in front of you set with a path that you know that you could follow, that you can sustain. And that's what that's what I love about wanting to create and teach people about podcasting. Is there's so much amazing things you can do, and it's very simple. It's not as difficult as some would want you to believe. I want to share all as much as I possibly can, and what as much as I've possibly learned in my journey of creating shows and creating podcasts, so that I can inspire a whole nother generation of podcasters who want to come up and learn and get into this field because it's pretty amazing. So if this episode has landed for you, if you wrote something down, if something clicked, I want to know about it. Find me where you find this show. Tell me what format you chose, tell me what you named your segment. Again, I read everything. You can email me again. My email address is podcast about podcasting. You can reach uh me on most of my social medias under the same name at the podcast about podcasting. Again, my name is Gabe Leal. I drop a new episode every Tuesday and Thursday. So I'll see you on the next episode. And remember, if you if you love podcasting, if you want to build a voice, then this is the show for you. Tune in every week. We have great guests sharing great insights, and then we're showing you the tool, we're giving you the tools to create your own show so that one day, one day you'll be able to share it with somebody else, help another podcaster starting out, share your journeys, and one day you'll become the veteran. You'll become the one who's who's spent five years in this world of podcasting. So until next time, this is Gabe signing off. Thanks again for listening. We'll talk to you next week. Bye for now. That's a wrap on another episode of the Podcast About Podcasting, the show where we bring in podcast experts and hosts every single week to help you build, grow, and sustain your show. If you found today's conversation useful, do us a huge favor and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. It truly helps us reach more podcasters just like you. New episodes drop every Tuesday and Thursday, so make sure you're subscribed and we'll see you next time.

Eleven Labs Speaker 29:16

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